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tim

it appears that Christians are continually known more for what they stand against rather than what they stand for.

Paul Fromont

Too true Jonny. I'm looking forward to seeing it too. And, like you, I've loved the books.

http://prodigal.typepad.com/prodigal_kiwi/2007/11/rowan-williams-.html

Thom

Sorry to disagree with the yes men. I was with you until you suggested allowing children to see it. First of all the action alone (in all it's surround sound, large screen omnipotence) is hard for children to comprehend and overcome, but if they do the underlying story is so subtle that they won't make the connection to "killing God" or "doing away with the Church" as some have said it promotes. So what's the harm then, you might ask.
I agree that we should challenge the thinking of the unbelieving world, but supporting the craft (putting $ in the pocket) of an avowed atheist is a stretch for me. Then again maybe my plumber is an atheist, or my doctor, or my trash man I don't know, but here I have a clear choice and the imortant thing I want for my kids at their age is support for what their relationship with God is, not to challenge the agenda of Hollywood or a particular author (who is good by the way), they will hopefully do this from a strong faith later in life. Like us?

Kester

As in life, so in football: the truth will out. We're above you. The rest is just fantasy ;-)

Laura

I don't think this is intended to be a kid movie. In the US it's rated PG-13. I saw actor Sam Sheppard on Charlie Rose and he said specifically that it's NOT a kid movie "it's rated PG-13 for a reason" was his direct quote. Given that the actors themselves are saying that, seems the wise thing to do to not take small children but I agree with the idea of seeing it with older kids and discussing it afterwards.

jonny

child doesn't equal kid. of course parents need to think what is appropriate when for their children. i took harry who is a child but he's 15!

thom your sentiment about not giving a dollar to an athiest is most bizarre. what sort of bubble or christian subculture do you want to live in? a ghetto with christians only? are athiests to be avoided or shunned?

Nic Dempsey

Sorry but this is really annoying me. I haven't seen the film yet but in the books God isn't killed, the Authority isn't the creator. Ogunwe says so in the the Amber Spyglass, “It shocked some of us, too, to learn that the Authority was not the creator.”

And he isn't killed, he dies, also from the Amber Spyglass:

'Between them they helped the ancient of days out of his crystal cell; it wasn’t hard, for he was as light as paper, and he would have followed them everywhere, having no will of his own, and responding to simple kindness like a flower to the sun. But in the open air there was nothing to stop the wind from damaging him, and to their dismay his form began to loosen and dissolve. Only a few moments later he had vanished completely, and their last impression was of those eyes, blinking in wonder, and a sigh of the most profound and exhausted relief.'

And if my faith can't survive someone telling me that God doesn't exist, then it's not much of a faith really. Pullman isn't practicing mind control here, he's open and honest about his atheism and you have a choice to read the books/go to the film. But all this nonsense about the story based on his atheism is spin of the worst kind and makes Pullman's point about organised religion and it's misuse of power..

jonny

thanks nic - nice quotes!

Carole

I have heard various objections to Pullman's books. I cannot speak from a position of authority, never having read them. However, I spent some time in a Year 6 class recently. As it was a faith school, I was surprised to see these books on the library shelves. The teacher told me that if the school leadership had read the books, they would possibly not have them in the school, but, I was told, they wouldn't have a clue about any controversy anyway. The teacher told me how he had seen a child, who did not have a habit of reading, take to these books and read them voraciously. Because they are, so I'm told, a cracking good read. We went to see the film as a family at the weekend. I explained to my 14 year-old daughter about the atheistic stance of the writer and the controversy about the books in Christian circles. Her response? "I'd rather make up my own mind about these things than have other people tell me what's right or wrong." I know this is a typical teenage response and in many areas of life it would not hold water. But having now seen the film I cannot fail to see the irony in some Christian groups who reinforce the authoritarian stance portrayed by the Magisterium. It was an enjoyable fantasy but has not impacted on our own beliefs in the slightest. At most, it puts an alternative perspective forward and opens up opportunities for discussion.

jon birch

kester's right of course. except about football... we're above him!
the first book is good, not read the rest yet. what is all the fuss about?!
looking forward to seeing the movie.

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